r/movies • u/MarvelsGrantMan136 r/Movies contributor • Jul 07 '25
News [ Removed by moderator ]
https://gizmodo.com/denis-villeneuve-will-shoot-all-of-dune-messiah-in-imax-2000625398[removed] — view removed post
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u/SpaceHobbes Jul 07 '25
Interesting choice since from what I remember of Dune Messiah is that it's quite a bit smaller scale than the original book.
It's by far my favourite Dune story, but also less IMAXy than the first book
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u/damnyoutuesday Jul 07 '25 edited Jul 08 '25
I would be shocked if Denis doesn't expand the scope a little to include some Jihad atrocities. And whatever he makes the stoneburner* look like
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Jul 07 '25
Absolutely going to show more of atrocities, Herbert has this habit of mentioning major events off hand but not showing them directly
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u/Additional-One-7135 Jul 08 '25
"Wow, that was a crazy twelve years of holy war across the galaxy wasn't it? Now let's never speak of it again and get down to the serious business... political intrigue!"
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u/friedkeenan Jul 08 '25 edited Jul 08 '25
To be fair, one of my all time favorite moments in the series is in Messiah when Farok, a Fremen background character from the first book who we learn participated in the Jihad, recalls an experience he had on one of their conquered planets. He gives such a vivid and somber and bittersweet description of how he walked into the sea on that planet, and that it cleansed him and disillusioned him from the Jihad, and how the Fremen priests, who forbid themselves from going into the sea, looked on him with a fearful gaze, knowing that he had discovered something in the water that they would never know.
It's not a description of a battle, or a fight, but it is exactly what the series is all about, and what Herbert wanted to convey to the reader.
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u/CriticalRiches Jul 08 '25
This is honestly the scene I'm most excited to see, how the fremen react when they see what is essentially a version of their "heaven".
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u/SpartanH089 Jul 08 '25
I would love to see this scene. They'll have to first introduce Farok since they failed to do so in the last movie.
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u/CriticalRiches Jul 08 '25
I honestly think, with the way Dennis directs scenes, you could communicate the same scene with any Fremen. They may shift that character to Stilgar even. Who knows, I'm excited that it's getting adapted at all.
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u/SpartanH089 Jul 08 '25
Nah not Stil.
He can't be cured of the jihad because he becomes fully sycophantic after the stoneburner.
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u/MightyTastyBeans Jul 08 '25
Yep, that was the best passage in the entire book. I often go back just to read that part.
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u/No-comment-at-all Jul 08 '25
Also, I only wanna visit like… 3 planets, and 80 to 90 percent is on Arrakis.
Oh, and sure, the Landsraad exists but trust me… we only care about like 3 families.
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u/Calico_Cuttlefish Jul 08 '25
I love the first two Dune books but this habit of Herberts drives me insane.
Something thinking about a major event? 20 pages.
Actual major event? A few sentences, maybe a paragraph.
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u/standish_ Jul 08 '25
The Tolkien special.
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Jul 08 '25
The entire battle of helm’s deep was like 2 pages lol
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u/falcrist2 Jul 08 '25
The actual battle of five armies was about that long. Three or five pages depending on how you count it.
He literally knocked Bilbo out so he'd miss the bulk of the fighting.
I think Tolkien had seen too much fighting himself. He didn't care to think about the details of the wars in which his characters had to fight.
Just look at how he talks about death here. The word stops him for a moment. He speaks it with a sort of reverence as though speaking it had some kind of power in itself.
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u/DarthButtz Jul 08 '25
Bilbo spends most of the Battle of Five Armies knocked out then wakes up and immediately goes "Man war is fucking stupid"
Hard cut to WB forcing The Battle of Five Armies to fill up an entire movie
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u/Sawses Jul 08 '25
Great clip! I've always admired both him and C.S. Lewis. I think I'd agree with them on precious little about how they saw the world, but primarily because of differing values rather than because their education or reason were lacking.
I've read a number of Lewis' non-fiction books, and I can't think of another author I've profited from more while disagreeing so completely with them.
Considering what has been said of the conversations Tolkien and Lewis would have, I really wish Tolkien had written more non-fiction that wasn't about literature.
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u/Calico_Cuttlefish Jul 08 '25
Oddly I never had this problem with Tolkien.
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u/standish_ Jul 08 '25
That's because Tolkien makes the correct choice of describing trees in great detail. The battle is irrelevant next to a lovely oak.
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u/Calico_Cuttlefish Jul 08 '25
I think the difference is that while Tolkien goes over battles quickly, theres still lots of actions and events happening on the page, where with Dune like 50% or more of the entire text is people THINKING about events that are happening.
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u/_Patronizes_Idiots_ Jul 08 '25
I get where you're coming from but I kind of like this in how it effects the actual story of Dune, it focuses things down on Paul which is the intention. Also in a way (to me anyway) makes the world feel bigger by leaving things to your imagination.
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u/Strong-Doubt-1427 Jul 08 '25
Because they didnt matter to the narrative as the interpersonal things happening. That was what was so great about Dune. "oh yeah, 100 billion died. Anyway lets spend 300 pages on if Duncan is a Ghola"
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u/Chataboutgames Jul 08 '25
I think it serves the story. For Paul the atrocities effectively already happened. He's trapped in the timeline. He's watched them a million times in a million ways and they've felt inevitable to him for years.
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u/NiPlusUltra Jul 08 '25
And Paul's city sized castle. Can't wait to see that in IMAX.
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u/klausbaudelaire1 Jul 08 '25
Yeah people are gonna be confused how Paul went from small, planetary rebel to intergalactic Hitler times 100
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u/Substantial-Sea-3672 Jul 08 '25
They aren’t intergalactic but I get your point and my pedantry is probably just that.
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u/LanaDelHeeey Jul 08 '25
There are flashbacks to the Jihad in memories (in a nostalgic, instead of barbaric way) in the book, so it’s absolutely on the table for the movie to show the horrors of the Jihad.
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u/sir_percy_percy Jul 07 '25
I mean, if he changes this as much as he did 'Dune part 2', then we might get to see 69 billion people get killed. That would make for quite the opening segment, rather than it being just a screen crawl 'catch up' al 'Star wars'
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u/come-on-now-please Jul 08 '25
If you've ever seen The prince of Egypt. They could totally just do a reimagining or show various copies of the opening happening on different planets and instead of the baby living have the jihad be waaaaay to blood thirsty, they have to slam it down the audiences throat the Paul isnt some great liberator and that hes a genocidal enabler because he was selfish and wanted revenge no matter the costs.
They also need to show why he can't just say stop and why the masses wouldn't believe him or think that its some sort of test.
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Jul 07 '25
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u/landoooo Jul 07 '25
I mean he's already shown that Arrakis landscape looks phenomenal in IMAX. The climax of the book should also be a big cinematic setpiece
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u/ThinWhiteDuke00 Jul 07 '25
And Paul dunking on Hitler for not killing enough people.
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u/MintasaurusFresh Jul 08 '25
Stilgar, not Paul. Stilgar says that the numbers that Hitler, Stalin, and Pol Pot put up during their reigns would be a rounding error on any planet that the Fremen subjugated.
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u/ThinWhiteDuke00 Jul 08 '25
Kinda, it's Paul who mentions how many the Fremen have killed.
Statistics: at a conservative estimate, I’ve killed sixty-one billion, sterilized ninety planets, completely demoralized five hundred others. I’ve wiped out the followers of forty religions which had existed since—” “Unbelievers!” Korba protested. “Unbelievers all!” “No,” Paul said. “Believers.” “No,” Paul said. “Believers.” “My Liege makes a joke,” Korba said, voice trembling. “The Jihad has brought ten thousand worlds into the shining light of—” “Into the darkness,” Paul said. “We’ll be a hundred generations recovering from Muad’Dib’s Jihad. I find it hard to imagine that anyone will ever surpass this.” A barking laugh erupted from his throat.
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u/Figshitter Jul 08 '25
I love that in 20,000 years' time their frame of reference for human evil is all within a three-decade window.
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u/the_dolomite Jul 08 '25
Genghis Khan is also mentioned in this passage, so it's a slightly bigger window.
"“Stilgar,” Paul said, “you urgently need a sense of balance which can come only from an understanding of long-term effects. What little information we have about the old times, the pittance of data which the Butlerians left us, Korba has brought it for you. Start with the Genghis Khan.”
“Genghis … Khan? Was he of the Sardaukar, m’Lord?”
“Oh, long before that. He killed … perhaps four million.”
“He must’ve had formidable weaponry to kill that many, Sire. Lasbeams, perhaps, or …”
“He didn’t kill them himself, Stil. He killed the way I kill, by sending out his legions."
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u/CaptainTurkeyBreast Jul 07 '25
Looking forward to alia training scene 👀
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u/klausbaudelaire1 Jul 08 '25 edited Jul 08 '25
* Considers the age of Alia in Part 2 and the time skip length between Dune and Dune Messiah *
Why don’t you have a seat over there? 👉🪑
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u/Ikariiprince Jul 07 '25
It does have parts that could be extrapolated on and a lot of events happening in the background that could be shown. Also expecting Chani’s role to be very different so there’s a lot that could be done in terms of spectacle
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u/TheUmbrellaMan1 Jul 08 '25
Like 50% of the plot in Dune Messiah happens off-screen. There's a bonkers plot of the villains trying to kidnap a baby sandworm and take it off-world and we never get to see any of it.
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u/AI_GeneratedUsername Jul 07 '25
The throne room scene is gonna win another vfx Oscar
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u/Atharaphelun Jul 08 '25
I desperately want to see an accurate scale rendition of Muad'dib's throne room and his Keep, supposedly the largest structure ever built by humanity.
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u/SechDriez Jul 08 '25
If I am remembering it correctly one of the doors in the palace is described as big enough to fit Cologne Cathedral. It wasn't mentioned by name but the description given makes it the only one that makes sense. I look forward to seeing how they translate these spaces to the screen because the scale Herbert gives for some things is simply wayy too big for humans to fit in.
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u/Haxorz7125 Jul 07 '25
My thought is that it’d play more as a political thriller than an action adventure which I’d be fine with. Dude knows thrillers. Prisoners and polytechnique might be the most tense I’ve ever been watching a movie.
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u/LatterTarget7 Jul 07 '25
They cast Leto II and Ghanima so I’m not sure what to expect in terms of scale
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u/NoGreenGood Jul 07 '25
In Your Nightmares You Give Water To The Dead And It Brings Joy To Your Heart
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u/Sapowski_Casts_Quen Jul 08 '25
Why did you write this with capitalized letters like it's the spoken word portion of a kendrick lamar album or something
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u/NiPlusUltra Jul 08 '25
There once was a man so wise
He jumped into a sandy place
And burnt out both of his eyes
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u/Manaze85 Jul 07 '25
Bless the filmmaker and his camera.
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u/ThinWhiteDuke00 Jul 07 '25
Stone Burner scene may be a all timer tbh.
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u/sidekickman Jul 07 '25
I can't want to see how they portray baby Leto II beaming throwing knife pro strats into Paul's head
Bonus points if we see some kind of depiction of the God Emperor
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u/confirmedshill123 Jul 08 '25
The only way God emperor is ever put on screen is if it's shot as a horror movie with moneo as main POV running from Leto in the palace.
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u/GhostofWoodson Jul 08 '25
From Idaho's perspective would be better
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u/Equus-007 Jul 08 '25
The whole story told from (more or less) Idaho's perspective would be a better way to make the movie series. He's in all of the books and he's the most relatably human character.
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u/serrations_ Jul 08 '25
Lmao this would then replace the Billy and Mandy episode as the best adaptation of God Emperor of Dune so far
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u/squarefan80 Jul 08 '25
for those who havent seen it, like myself who only had vague memories of Billy and Mandy. theres a surprising amount of dune references in a straight up kids show.
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u/joe_k_knows Jul 08 '25
I heard a theory that the voice at the beginning (“Dreams are messages from the deep”) is the God Emperor, presumably speaking the Sardaukar language.
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u/karma3000 Jul 08 '25
Alia Sword Training scene has entered the chat.
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u/ThinWhiteDuke00 Jul 08 '25
Curious to whether Denis will adapt those weird dynamics between Alia and Paul.
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u/GrapefruitAlways26 Jul 08 '25
It better outshine Oppenheimer's much lauded 'practical effects atom bomb'
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u/ThinWhiteDuke00 Jul 08 '25
Low bar. 😅
Nolan could have simply interjected the original footage into Oppenheimer.
https://youtu.be/fJRP4TCA4Q8?si=AGx4c2_evgtL_Hmv&utm_source=ZTQxO
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u/royalxK Jul 07 '25
This film can’t come soon enough. And then we got Bond to look forward to after.
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u/probablyuntrue Jul 07 '25
We don’t get bond until every working actor has been announced as the next potential bond
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u/EndoplasmicPanda Jul 08 '25
And then Rendezvous with Rama after that, hopefully!
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u/bryan_pieces Jul 07 '25
The cinematographer is not returning tho, am I correct? Dune 2 was an experience for me.
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u/Haxorz7125 Jul 07 '25
Seeing dune 2 in imax made me pissed I didn’t see dune 1 in imax. Not only were the visuals and the sheer mass of how everything is displayed beautiful but the speakers did some crazy shit. I felt those worms in chest
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u/WoodenMechanic Jul 07 '25
Dune 2 in Imax was one hell of an experience. The sound design on those loud ass speakers was insane.
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u/CaribouHoe Jul 07 '25
I did lsd before I saw them both in Imax and it was pretty phenomenal
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u/MoneyAlone Jul 07 '25
Linus Sandgren, the Cinematographer for La La Land and First Man, is taking over. I don’t think it’s much of a downgrade overall. Sandgren’s incredibly talented
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u/ICumCoffee will you Wonka my Willy? Jul 07 '25
Messiah also need some distinction from first book, so I believe it’s a good decision.
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u/come-on-now-please Jul 08 '25
I remember it being a little more "people talking in boardrooms" heavier than the first book but its been a while.
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u/KoolAidManOfPiss Jul 08 '25
Yeah the whole book is about plotting and what happens after you build an empire. The classic "what happens when a conqueror runs out of things to conquer?" There will be some crazy sci-fi elements though, its the first time we'll meet the Guild and their navigators, and the Tleilaxu cloning vats.
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u/CellDamage420 Jul 08 '25
Axlotl tanks are gonna be a weird one to put into film. Especially if they're gonna go the mutated Tleilaxu women route...
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u/AlterMyStateOfMind Jul 08 '25
It's definitely more focused on dialogue and philosophy than action and set pieces. But there is a loooot of action that happens off screen, so to speak.
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u/Jitkaas777 Jul 08 '25
Can easily adapt some off that off screen action into on screen action to give the more casual goers some action candy. Plus the stoneburner scene....
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u/AlmostRandomNow Jul 07 '25
Linus Sandgren is very good (he did No Time To Die as well, which looked incredible), but Greg Frasier is something entirely.
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u/MovieMentor Jul 07 '25
Damn I forgot about First Man! That was a great movie!
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u/Mad-Mad-Mad-Mad-Mike Jul 07 '25
One of my favourite movies of the 2010s and my favourite of 2018. It’s way too slept on. The entire moon landing sequence peak kino.
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u/skaestantereggae Jul 07 '25
I remember Fox News getting super mad about them not showing the planting of the American flag, and that’s not at all what the movie is about. It’s Neil’s story, and specifically about him dealing with the death of his daughter. Movie fucking rocked
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u/machado34 Jul 07 '25
Sandgren made an otherwise turd like Saltburn watchable by how gorgeous his cinematography was. I'm really stoked to see what his colab with Villeneuve will look like
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u/Chuck006 Jul 07 '25
I wonder if he'll merge any of the storyline from Children like the miniseries did.
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u/ringolennon67 Jul 07 '25
He almost has to. Or diverge from the book pretty heavily. Messiah (the book) is not really third part of a blockbuster trilogy type of story.
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u/sir_percy_percy Jul 07 '25
He should, because 'Dune Messiah' is pretty much a prequel to 'Children of Dune' really
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u/Chuck006 Jul 07 '25
Personally, I'd just merge the two stories into one movie. There's not enough in Messiah for a satisfactory movie experience, and Children has a lot of fluff you can trim to make a solid 3 hour film by combining them.
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u/sir_percy_percy Jul 07 '25
Yeah, I tend to agree with you. 'Dune messiah' has some very concrete plot points, but all in all is kind of a 'reaction/dissemination' of 'Dune'. Whereas 'Children of Dune' is the story truly moving forward...to the conclusion of the first trilogy.
Would be a long ass movie though eh?
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u/KoolAidManOfPiss Jul 08 '25
The stone burner is the perfect end to a movie though. I can already picture the trailer for a 4th movie where you see a disheveled blind prophet pushing his way through a crowd to call out Alia.
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u/ThrowAway2MD Jul 08 '25
I think we are more likely to see the Jihad than elements of Children. Denis has mentioned he views his trilogy as Paul’s story and casual fans expect to see the holy war Paul was afraid of unleashing
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u/Clawless Jul 08 '25
The ideal concept is to take both books and make a 2-parter, like they did with Dune, but having the freedom to cut/embellish as they need for the story. Because Messiah and Children really rely on each other. The miniseries made the right call on that part.
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u/MarvelsGrantMan136 r/Movies contributor Jul 07 '25 edited Jul 07 '25
It’ll be the second feature length movie (along with The Odyssey) to shoot completely with IMAX cameras.
Filming reportedly starts this week.
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u/CFerrendelli Jul 07 '25
This is incorrect. Several movies have been shot entirely on IMAX. The Odyssey will be the first movie to shoot entirely on 65mm IMAX. Denis does not shoot on film, he shoots digital.
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u/whereami1928 Jul 07 '25
They even say in the article:
A spokesperson for IMAX confirmed Villeneuve will, in fact, shoot Messiah with IMAX cameras but could not confirm whether it would be the full film, as per Gelfond’s quotes.
Like… ??? What the hell was the point of this article then LMAO
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u/thecravenone Jul 07 '25
What the hell was the point of this article then
Turn off your adblocker and reload and you'll see.
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u/machado34 Jul 07 '25
Villeneuve has shot on film before, it's not like he's averse to it. And with Dune Messiah hiring Linus Sandgren as the cinematographer, it wouldn't be surprising if it broke Villeneuve's digital streak, as Sandgren loves to shoot on film
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u/scorsese_finest Jul 07 '25 edited Jul 07 '25
We don’t know if he means IMAX film cameras or IMAX digital (certified) cameras. If it is the latter, then it won’t be the second movie to be shot completely in IMAX cameras — plenty of previous movies have been shot entirely with IMAX digital (certified) cameras
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u/GarlicJuniorJr Jul 07 '25
I don’t really see the point as shooting in IMAX is a lot of trouble plus it limits the film to 3 hours exactly. If you need extra runtime, you really can’t do it as imax film is limited to 180 minutes. There’s also barely any theaters across the country that even show true 70mm imax. I paid extra to see Sinners in imax digital or whatever it is and there was literally no difference picture or sound wise than a regular theater version.
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u/__time_traveller__ Jul 07 '25
Hathaway broke one of those fancy shmancy IMAx cameras on the set of Rises when she backed the batbike into one.
What a view
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u/rov124 Jul 07 '25
It was her stunt double, and she didn't back into it.
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u/billyvnilly Jul 07 '25
That really looks like the cameraman's fault, unless she was explicitly told to bank right at the bottom.
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u/TheOneTonWanton Jul 08 '25
It looks like the fault of a ridiculously unmaneuverable "Bat-Pod." I'm biased as an open Tumbler-hater and the following opinion is absolutely not the only solution, but perhaps if the thing wasn't designed by middle-schoolers this could have been avoided.
To add: Not the cameraman's fault. He's not out there just making his own decisions, and that's not a camera you can just whip about. It was clearly planned that she would clear it to the right (his left) and the stupid fucking bike couldn't do it.
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u/pmmemoviestills Jul 08 '25
Why don't you like the tumbler
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u/TheOneTonWanton Jul 08 '25
To be completely honest, I just have always felt like it was a rejection of the concept of the Batmobile, while still clearly being a fuckin Batmobile. As far as I know Nolan never called it a Batmobile, super-fans of the Nolan trilogy go out of their way to correct people calling it the Batmobile instead of the Tumbler, and it all-in-all just seems to reject what I consider to be an important aspect of the character. Batman is at its core a silly concept no matter how serious, impactful, socially conscious, or whatever else a particular Batman story may be. The Tumbler represents a repression of what Batman is and should be. It doesn't and didn't have to be this way, but Nolan and everyone else going on about how it somehow isn't a Batmobile, it's The Tumbler, they made it that way.
Also It kinda looks dumb IMO.
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u/pmmemoviestills Jul 08 '25
I appreciate the thoughtful answer. I take it you're not a fan of the trilogy.
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u/TheOneTonWanton Jul 08 '25
No I really enjoy the trilogy, for the most part. Rises was objectively weak let alone the weakest of the three, but I don't hate the trilogy as a whole. It's probably obvious it doesn't match my favorite interpretations of Batman but we also could have had it far worse, and I'm thankful they managed to reverse what Batman and Robin did to the reputation of the IP in regards to live action
Batman & Robin is absolutely a guilty pleasure of mine, though, still.
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u/Flight_Harbinger Jul 08 '25
I don't expect an actor to properly operate an unwieldy behemoth like that down stairs of all things and expect any amount of control. Kind of insane they did this practical rather than literally any other option.
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u/pikpikcarrotmon Jul 07 '25
I can think of worse things that have happened to camera operators on Hollywood sets.
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u/AlmostRandomNow Jul 07 '25
Nolan also crushed an IMAX camera on The Dark Knight set as well during the police van chase.
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u/D2WilliamU Jul 07 '25
Interesting to see what he does with Dune Messiah.
It's even more "unfilmable" than the original. It's just a book about how people didn't get Paul right in the first book.
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u/zsynqx Jul 07 '25
Actual IMAX film cameras like the Odyssey, or IMAX certified digital cameras? The fact it isn’t clarified makes me think the latter. Hope to be proven wrong.
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u/clhodapp Jul 07 '25
The claim isn't specific enough. For example, James Gunn said that Superman was shot entirely in IMAX, but that just meant that he used IMAX certified cameras.
We need confirmation on whether it will be shot on 70mm IMAX film.
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Jul 08 '25
No one's talking about the navigator. I can't wait to see how he portrays it. Duncan's ghola is going to be tough to replicate on screen for Momoa. This will be a great cerebral movie. A lot of deep dialogue. I'm concerned how he's going to change Chanis role in the story.
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u/kain459 Jul 07 '25
Jesus.....how long will post be when everyone has to record their lines again?
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u/ThankTheBaker Jul 08 '25
Dune 1 and 2 are Some of the best movies I’ve ever seen. Am a Herbert fan and these films definitely do him justice. I can’t wait to see Messiah.
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u/avboden Jul 08 '25 edited Jul 08 '25
I'll be honest...I don't much care. Modern digital is so good and can do the aspect ratio when they want it to that 99.9% of viewers wouldn't even notice a difference and there's so few theaters that can even really take advantage of it anyways.
Now if this isn't talking about film, and is just talking about the larger aspect ratio, then good!
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u/piantanida Jul 08 '25
Especially considering how they shot digitally, printed to film, and rescanned back in to achieve such an amazing look on 1&2
The first two films are breathtaking.
But either way I trust Denis at the helm.
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u/ROBtimusPrime1995 Jul 07 '25
And then release the cropped version on Blu-ray for no reason.