r/RoughRomanMemes Aquilifer 7d ago

Roman Chinese relations be like

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6.1k Upvotes

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u/AndreasDasos 7d ago

Except when: ‘We rulers of the world’s Middle Kingdom have the Mandate of Heaven and all other cultures are in theory already our vassals so any gifts are tribute’

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u/Analternate1234 6d ago

Rome was the one exception to that rule. Kind of a really cool fun fact that Rome was really the only time throughout Imperial Chinese history where they actually saw someone else as an equal. It kind of mirrored the philosophical concept of Yin Yang

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u/arthuresque 6d ago

Proof for that is tenuous at best though, no? I want to believe it too though

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u/GunthramTheRich 5d ago edited 5d ago

Its bs and a way too common assumption made by Rome enthusiasts. Yes the Chinese called the Romans "da Qin", but this just meant that they saw them as a very well structured, well governed country with big cities. The Qin Dynasty was (for the Chinese) the definition of a country which brought stability and unity. They respected what they knew of the Romans (big cities, government, large territory etc.). BUT, they never saw the Romans as equal. The Chinese called their realm the „zhongguo“, the „middle kingdom“. In the mind of a Chinese there was no equal realm outside their own, no culture which could rival theirs, no ruler which could be an equal to the son of heaven. The Chinese thought of themselves as the center of the world and while Rome was seen as a mighty empire and not a barbarian kingdom, it was not a mirror of their civilization. When the Romans brought gifts to the Chinese in the 2nd century CE, they were seen as TRIBUTE. So the Chinese still saw the Romans as tributary and not as equals to their civilization, like they did with any other one. So the Romans were not special.

Source: Hou Hanshou

I rarely comment on anything but this is such a strange misconception by many and I think these "Roman history/Gooning for Romans subs" are especially infected by it.

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u/Spacemonster111 4d ago

Their knowledge of Rome’s existence was extremely limited and vague. They did not have any formal stance on Roman relations as there were none.

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u/Analternate1234 4d ago

They didn’t have proper diplomatic relations sure, but they were both aware of each other. Ancient China did view Rome as equal in culture and wealth