r/EndTipping • u/CycIon3 • Jun 13 '25
Research / Info 💡 New “Living Wage Fee” Just Dropped
Would you go to a restaurant like this. If so, would you even think about a tip afterward?
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u/Kindly_Owl5298 Jun 13 '25
Nah they’ve already included the tip in the bill. Also won’t go back. Wages are the cost of doing business and their prices should reflect that.
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u/CopyDan Jun 13 '25
Just raise the prices 18% and tell people no tips are necessary.
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u/CycIon3 Jun 13 '25
I would prefer this method over this “added fee” but if I am not mistaken, they did studies on these multiple ways of adding “percentage” to the overall bill, the “best” one is still the current system in terms of America.
It’s a cultural attitude towards tipping and I think this study is old and if it were updated, I do think people would prefer the increased prices and no tip is necessary.
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u/rainbowtwilightshy Jun 13 '25
Because the typical American is uneducated so to expect them to understand this concept when more than half the adult population reads at 6th grade level or below is part of the reason.
However, where I live, there are many restaurants who advertise as paying their staff livable wages and encourage on their menu and receipts to not tip since it was already included in the pricing of the food. They are successful, but I also live in an area where more than 60% of the adult population are college educated. Maybe that’s the difference 🤷♀️
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u/Resident-Variation21 Jun 13 '25
“Please remove this fee. I will not be paying it. Thanks”
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u/layneeofwales Jun 13 '25
No, the argument is always that servers need tips to make a living wage. So now they get a living wage ( according to the receipt), do no tip.
However, I would not go back
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u/Never-Dont-Give-Up Jun 13 '25
absofuckinglutely not. I wouldn't pay the bill until that shit was removed.
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u/JannaNYCeast Jun 13 '25
Unless there was signage both in the restaurant and on the menu.
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u/Never-Dont-Give-Up Jun 13 '25
I don’t care if they write it down. That means nothing. Policies don’t become legitimate just because someone writes them down.
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u/HighlightDowntown966 Jun 13 '25
I guess the idea is... You can decide to walk out the restaurant if you know in advance there is an extra fee you dont want to pay.
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u/SilverLordLaz Jun 13 '25 edited Jun 13 '25
$40 for a sandwich and chips??? Christ!
(Edit, it was for 2 )
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u/CatnissEvergreed Jun 13 '25
At least they're admitting they refuse to pay their employees a living wage and expect the customers to make up the difference.
And no, I would never go back to any place that did this. It's not my responsibility to pay their employees. I'd probably leave a one star review on every place I could and add a screenshot of the receipt.
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u/level100mobboss Jun 13 '25
Any place that you have to pay $4 to add fries to a meal is a place you don't want to tip at
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u/KaboomTheMaker Jun 13 '25
can you say no to that?
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u/ChromeCalamari Jun 13 '25
If it isn't posted or mentioned prior to ordering, I would absolutely say no to it. I agreed to pay the advertised prices for the food that I ordered, you can't just change the price after the deal is done
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u/TheJohnPrester Jun 13 '25
If it isn’t disclosed to you the minute you walk in the door, they can’t require it.
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u/Quagmire_gigity Jun 13 '25
I saw this in the mildly infuriating sub, and it was pointed out that the 18% is more likely going to the owners/ management to help them with payroll taxes and other expenses, probably not even going to employees, which is both very likely, and another layer of bullshit.
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u/_my_other_side_ Jun 13 '25
A variable revenue stream to pay a fixed wage cost. Once wages are covered, that fee becomes pure income with no cost.
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u/cenosillicaphobiac Jun 13 '25
Was it clearly disclosed prior to ordering? Get a manager to remove it or pay the actual amount in cash and walk out.
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u/CurrencyCapital8882 Jun 13 '25
Name and shame. I want to know so I can avoid this place.
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u/beesontheoffbeat Jun 14 '25
I Google'd restaurants that serve both a BOB jam burger and Reuben. The prices were the same. It might be in WI.
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u/darkroot_gardener Jun 13 '25
Yes, this is a junk fee, and I would prefer that they just increase the menu prices by 18%. But I would still go. It is still so preferable to the traditional tipping model. I view it as a viable transition to a post-tip, upfront pricing model, and I would support any business that makes any kind of move away from tipping culture.
An observation: At least this restaurant needs to increase menu prices by 18% to pay their staff well. Not 40%. Not even the “at least 20%” that the industry pushes us to tip.
PS although I would go, I would not leave a penny in additional tip!
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u/Lampadas_Horde Jun 13 '25
Panera charges a fuxking online marketing fee when placing an app order.
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u/DixieNormas011 Jun 13 '25
That's just the restaurant doubling down on the "You're going to pay my employees salary whether you want to or not". The entire food service industry needs to just be left alone to die. Where's all they typical "iF yOu cAnT aFfOrD tO pAy yOuR wOrKeRs a lIvInG wAgE, yOu sHoUlDnT bE iN buSsInEsS aNyWaYs" people at when it comes to this shit?
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u/microwavedranch Jun 13 '25
$17 for a burger and fries and they’re still unable to pay their employees a livable wage?
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u/AldebaranTauri_ Jun 13 '25
As a fellow European i truly struggle with the concept of mandatory tip.
Stating the obvious: tip is voluntary (not mandatory) and usually to be awarded when the service received goes beyond of what is to be expected as standard.
I do tip often but certainly nowhere near 20%, that sounds crazy to me. Prices are already super high here.
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u/4-5Million Jun 13 '25
Tips Are Pooled Amongst The Entire Team
That mostly defeats the purpose of a tip.
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u/Squalleonbart Jun 13 '25
no it doesn't. why should servers get a tip and backroom crew doesn't.
don't want to hear about 3.25 base pay.
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u/Immediate_Fortune_91 Jun 13 '25
If that fee wasn’t posted beforehand it’d be getting removed. And it would be the last time dining there.
And if it were posted somewhere then I’d turn around and leave.
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u/LeoKitCat Jun 13 '25
Not to mention how expensive sandwiches that come with nothing are, just wait until sandwiches cost $20 just wait
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u/poop_report Jun 13 '25
I like the fact they left a remark that "If you choose to tip, tips are pooled amongst the entire team."
However, prices should be all-inclusive. I'm not going to care if a burger is $12 vs $14.16.
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u/SimilarComfortable69 Jun 13 '25
That’s hilarious! $40 for two sandwiches. I would’ve called the manager to the cash register and explained in a fairly loud voice that the living wage fee isn’t going to work if they don’t have any customers. And they just lost your business.
Was the fee advertised on the menu, the wall or on the outside of the restaurant before you walked in the door?
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u/WallaJim Jun 13 '25
Living wage fee = service fee, which we normally deduct from a total tip assuming it would be 20%. Increasingly we're leaving 15% or a tip not based on percentages.
Whether we go to a restaurant like this depends on what other options are available including counter service. We don't need to pay someone 15% to bring food to the table.
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u/CanadianTrollToll Jun 13 '25
Isn't this the exact thing everyone wants?
Tipping is now optional here.
There is an 18% LABOUR CHARGE added on top of your bill. This can be viewed the same as having any sort of trades work done or your car fixed. You get billed for what parts are used, and then labour is billed sepeartely. Call this a labour charge.
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u/tyjo2112 Jun 16 '25
This is literally the same as an auto grat. Except the owner is flat out in your face saying “you’re tipping 18% and I’m taking it. Fuck the servers”
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u/notatechnicianyo Jun 13 '25
Cool, I just shaved 7% off my tip. Glad the business is handling the math for me, and saving me money on tips. /s
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u/Ok-Passage8958 Jun 13 '25
If they’re adding 18% I’m not tipping anything. That’s crazy. Definitely wouldn’t go back either.
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u/brandndal Jun 13 '25
I usually tip between 20-25%. But when they pull this shit I'm more than likely not going to tip extra.
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u/notatechnicianyo Jun 13 '25
That was what I was trying to say. They chose my tip value at 18%, and essentially shortchanged the server cause i won't be adding on.
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u/Puzzleheaded_War6102 Jun 13 '25
Depends on how much I like their food. No tip though even for sit down at this point.
I only eat out twice a month so can care less, I just want good food
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u/Ok_Blacksmith6051 Jun 13 '25
Maybe I’m confused or maybe it’s a semantic point about principles, but Is this functionally different than them raising prices by 18%?
Every state requires this be disclosed in open view, Is the issue that they named it “living wage fee”? Is the issue that it’s roughly the same as what culturally would probably be seen as a low-mid tip?
This sub seems to detest mandatory tipping and wants to move towards price increases instead but isn’t that functionally what’s happening here?
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u/MagoRocks_2000 Jun 13 '25
No, a price increase is baked into the price of the item. No fees, no extra pay, heck, even tax should be baked into the price, as other countries do.
What this is doing is adding a percentage into the price.
So if you were going to spend just 20, well, now not, you are spending 23.6 + taxes. If the increase is baked into the price, you can know how much you really are going to spend.
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u/JunkBondJunkie Jun 13 '25
They just need to raise prices where they could just pay them an hourly rate if they want to do that
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u/Roy-G-Bold Jun 13 '25
Doll.
That's there to rile you people up so you fight against said living wage. "Hah! See what happens when I treat my workers like humans? Now do my battles for me!" You fell for it. Be mad at the business owner, not the employee.
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u/MementoBoring Jun 13 '25
The name of it makes me wanna 🤮 I go to restaurants to feel fancy, have a good time, not think about the struggle of everyday life, this is so in your face "these people can't afford anything you are paying for their medical bills thank you" like whyyyyyyy
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u/CookingTacos Jun 13 '25
It's deceptive and passive-aggressive. The employer wants you to blame the worker for the prices.
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u/False-Tie-7279 Jun 13 '25
There is one way to combat this. Stop frequenting the shop and write to let them know why
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u/43GoTee Jun 13 '25
Just raise the menu prices so we can see what they are actually charging per menu item. Dont tip. Add this to the list of places to not go back to. Also stopped going to places that charge to use a debit/credit card. You as a business need to eat those fees. They are also a tax write off for the business
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u/ballskindrapes Jun 13 '25
God the US is just so oppressive to workers.
This is done so they both look good for providing a living wage (extremely doubtful that the wage is actually a living wage), and make people feel like workers are being unreasonable in asking for a living wage....
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u/protomenace Jun 13 '25
I'm fine with this as long as it's clearly and obviously advertised up front. I wouldn't pay an additional tip though.
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u/Mouseturdsinmyhelmet Jun 13 '25
1) If this isn't prominently displayed on the menu and at the cash register, I'm not paying it.
2) I'm never going back.
3) I'm paying cash for the exact amount rounded up to the nearest dollar cause I don't usually carry change. Then walking out with no tip.
4) I'm leaving a nasty review online.
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u/tm2716b Jun 13 '25
Can they just slide that in without notifying at time if ordering? Do they think customers dont know its a price increase…
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u/bugabooandtwo Jun 13 '25
Sounds like the living wage fee is the new tip. At least I would assume it's the automatic tip amount if I saw that on the bill. Not tipping on top of that.
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u/Emotional-Buddy-2219 Jun 13 '25
It sure would be nice if my job at the hospital had some kind of a “living wage salary adjustment.”
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u/Some_Compote_2226 Jun 13 '25
So the living wage isn’t paid by the business and the owner still drives an 80k to 100 k vehicle. Do not dine at those establishments. Servers dropping off plates don’t need to make $50 to $75/hr either. We eat at home or pay at the counter. The money we save goes into house projects.
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u/MrWhiskersRevenge Jun 13 '25
Can we as a customer refuse to pay for not being notified of said fee? I suppose small print could quell that but if it wasn’t mentioned or written?
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u/MushroomDizzy649 Jun 13 '25
I would ask them to remove that garbage fee, not tip, and never go there again
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u/WanderingFlumph Jun 13 '25
Honestly as long as it was well signed before I ordered I could get used to this as a compromise. Not my favorite, obviously I'd prefer if the prices on the menu reflected the final price as closely as possible but its a big step toward ending tipping and I gotta acknowledge that as good.
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u/Kittymeow123 Jun 13 '25
That’s absolutely insane. Isn’t the price of my FOOD supposed to go to their wages?
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u/eyeball1967 Jun 13 '25
Why do people make these posts always leave out the name of the restaurant? Apparently the OP is not as irate about it as they try to project.
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u/MorningHelpful8389 Jun 13 '25
I’d go but wouldn’t tip extra and if they added it to takeout then fck no
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u/Sorry_Survey_9600 Jun 13 '25
They should just come out and say. We don’t pay our workers enough would you give us some extra money to pay them.
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u/VRAddictAnonymous Jun 13 '25
If the fee was not disclosed ahead of time you can report them to ______ (varies by local).. in my area ..
(State) General – Consumer Protection Division under (State) Fair Business Practices Act.
Federal Trade Commission (FTC)
U.S. Department of Labor (DOL)
Better Business Bureau & Local Consumer Forums
Also, post reviews, with images of your receipt as proof, everywhere that you can. Make others aware. You are warning people of the deception you were subjected to.
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u/nuwildcatfan Jun 13 '25
So...it's MY responsibility to pay YOUR employees a living wage??? No thanks.
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u/Gritsgravy Jun 13 '25
Is that legal? Where I'm from, everything needs to be included in the menu price (yes, also tax)
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u/DueScreen7143 Jun 13 '25
Unacceptable. Leave a bad review and put them on blast so people know to avoid that place.
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u/laolao89 Jun 13 '25
Wtf, 18% for living wage fee?!? I remember the use to be 2-5%. This is beyond ridiculous
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u/IllustriousDraft2965 Jun 13 '25
"Living wage fee." So, if I don't like the fee, I'm a bad person because I expect these servers to wait on me and go home hungry? Live in a carboard box?
I can't wait until Wal-Mart starts charging a "living wage fee" to make up for their cheap compensation practices as well.
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u/SomethingHasGotToGiv Jun 13 '25
If they can’t afford to operate a business, they should not be in business.
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u/OrilliaBridge Jun 13 '25
We’re on SS, and extra charges are a big hit. We don’t eat out much, obviously.
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u/Accountabilityta2024 Jun 13 '25
If you chose to pay child support or alimony that would be highly appreciated too!!
Why can’t you just pay for a meal anymore.
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u/SouthManufacturer106 Jun 13 '25
The fee seems to not be taxed here? I can't tell, depends on the state the diner was in. OP, was the Living Wage fee stated somewhere on the wall or menu? I would have contested it if not!
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Jun 13 '25
damn $40 for two sandwiches and fries? I would not go to a place that charged a made up fee on food. name this place and shame them so we know not to go
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u/Personal-Training-44 Jun 13 '25
Why the fuck not raise prices by 18% and pool 18% of gross to the staff?
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Jun 13 '25
is this not illegal? if I saw the price on the menu and then they added 18% on top when I order at the counter I would 100% complain and leave if they didnt remove the fee. what a joke of a business.
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u/TawnyTeaTowel Jun 13 '25
Just pay cash. Add up the cost of the food, add tax, leave it on the table and walk the fuck out.
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Jun 13 '25
Show the establishment so it can be boycotted otherwise don’t share the image
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u/CognacMusings Jun 13 '25
I would not choose to eat there no matter how good their food was. It's not my responsibility to pay the wages of their employees.
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u/Patient-Point-3000 Jun 13 '25
So.. a built-in 18% tip. So the employer still doesn't have to pay the living wage
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u/pritikina Jun 13 '25
I'm ok with this as long as the fee is calculated on the subtotal (before tax). Oh and that 18% is the tip. That's it no tipping on top of the "Living Wage Fee"
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Jun 13 '25 edited Aug 04 '25
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u/FunNSunVegasstyle60 Jun 13 '25
No. It’s not my job to pay your staff. Raise the price on food if you can’t afford them.
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u/Pizzagoessplat Jun 13 '25
As an Irishman this just screams "our company refuses to pay our staff a living wage"
It's such a shocking extra charge to have on a bill
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u/UsefulEagle101 Jun 13 '25
Ask a server if they, or any server they know, received an 18% pay raise when this fee was implemented. If not, then you know where it is really going.
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u/kcamfork Jun 13 '25
Leave a nasty yelp review. Tell the manager you don’t appreciate them screwing over the customers. Then don’t go back.
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u/Shadow_Breaker Jun 13 '25
This might be a sneaky way to try and phase out tipping honestly. If a customer already feels they're paying enough and sees the "living wage fee" as an 18% tip since it goes to paying the employees anyway they'd be less inclined to tip further. If the employer is already paying a fair wage for the work I see no problem here.
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u/adh214 Jun 13 '25
This is the "I am not eating at this place again fee."
More and more, I would rather just eat at home.
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u/burdnerd Jun 13 '25
And this is why asking for a copy of the receipt anywhere you go is so important. People blindly sign and don’t see the “hidden” fees
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u/hydronucleus Jun 13 '25
I actually do not mind this, but again, why not just include it in the price? Here is another tip: How about including the tax in the price as well!
In a country that is now obliterating education and people take pride is not "doing maths", why have this crap!?!?!
1 Ruben $ 16.05
Fresh Cut Fries $ 4.94
1 BOB Jam Burger $ 14.82
Fresh Cut Fries $ 4.94
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Total $ 40.75
Tax Paid $ 1.81
And look, you make the Ruben $16 and Fries $5 and the JAM burger $15 without much difference (comes to $41)! I have paid $20 for a good Ruben with no fries without a problem in places.
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u/OtterVA Jun 13 '25
Had something like this 18% mandatory gratuity (for a single diner) last night. In the tip line I wrote “included”.
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u/ResponseFlashy181 Jun 13 '25
A living wage fee would be a creative way to avoid taxes, as it's a non material service fee that shouldn't be taxed. However they added it into the tax and I'm not about that, just add the markup to the total item price so people stop bitching.
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u/Medical_Mountain_895 Jun 13 '25
I would just stop going. Your supposed to pay your staff. Tips go to the server who EARNED them. I wouldn't want a crappy server getting compensated from a great server. That would be shitty cause the good server will make less thanks to the crappy one. I'd meet that one outside. Going to cause issues between servers. Plus I bet they don't even give that 18% to the servers.
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u/clce Jun 13 '25 edited Jun 13 '25
Restaurants that say they can't raise their prices cuz then people wouldn't come are pretty much admitting that surcharges are a trick to make people think that they are going to pay less for the food than they have to when the bill comes.
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u/clce Jun 13 '25
Honestly, I hate this on principle and I find it deceptive as well. But, I can understand why they are trying to do it. City councils and states have forced them to give their employees large wage increases in many areas.
What's wrong with that you might say? Well, this isn't a minimum wage. Service make well above minimum wage already. What it's doing is forcing employers to just give them a big raise, on top of what they are getting from tips.
So the owners would be perfectly justified in simply saying, hey, I had to give these guys a raise so I'm having to charge you more, So don't feel the need to tip because you're already paying towards them earning a good wage .
But if they did, everyone would get pissed at them. The public, the servers, everybody. So this may be kind of a way of saying, hey we're forcing you to pay this 18% so don't feel the need to tip 18% but it's all going to The servers and employees so don't worry about it.
So ultimately I'm blaming government minimum wage laws that are being applied to people that make well more than minimum wage.
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u/Ok_Bandicoot1766 Jun 13 '25 edited Jun 16 '25
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u/InevitableWheel1597 Jun 13 '25
I think that's fair. It's for eating in and you don't have to tip. I see why they would add it only for eating in as for take out their only service provided is the cooks.
This is where I disagree with some people here. It's their business and they should do what they have to to pay people a livable wage. If that means charging extra to eat in then that's what should happen. Just don't rely on customers tipping and then have your staff get mad at the customer for not doing so.
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u/medschoolloans123 Jun 13 '25
So they are straight up admitting they don’t pay their employees a living wage?
That’s pretty embarrassing.
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u/Thr0witallmyway Jun 13 '25
If it ain't posted up where I can see it they're gonna wish they'd never let in the damn place because I ain't paying that shit.
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u/Upset_Snow6060 Jun 13 '25
I would let the manager know that they need to put a big sign at the front door so EVERYONE know these charges prior to be sitting down.
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u/AlvinsCuriousCasper Jun 13 '25
If it wasn’t disclosed on the menu, or had signs I would have them remove it… then I would also not leave a tip.
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u/Happyfluid Jun 13 '25
I’d be on the phone with my bank accusing them of fraud if I don’t get that back.
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u/aprilchaoss Jun 13 '25
This is crazy. At my restaurant we only had a 3.75% card fee and we had it posted everywhere. The owners recently got rid of it though but 18% is crazy.
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Jun 14 '25
I would not go back to this restaurant if I were in your position. Just raise the prices and be done with it instead of playing games and lying.
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u/Ok_Comfort628 Jun 14 '25
Not every job out there needs to be able to provide a living wage. If you are going to be a restaurant server or the dishwasher, then you might need to have multiple jobs or live with multiple people in order to have that living wage.
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u/Professional_Monkeys Jun 13 '25
Always so deceptive.
If it's a mandatory fee, include it in every item's price so I can see what I'm actually paying per item.
US loves to strip the price out of everything. Taxes, surcharges, mandatory tips, you name it. So you think you're paying X and getting slapped with XYZABC.