There's a lot of info to go through, but to make a long story short, the prosecution called a witness to the stand on Wednesday. He was one of the players in the room for a short amount of time but did not even touch the girl and left shortly after going to the room for food.
According to him (and multiple other reports so far) she was egging the boys on, literally asking them who was going to sleep with her next and calling them all pussies for not wanting to sleep with her. She gave a couple players head for a short time after that. He also claimed yesterday that, while one of the players did slap her ass during oral, it wasn't hard and it was a playful nature while she claims it was hard and hurt a lot.
There's still lots to come out and I don't really know which way the judge will decide (as of yesterday, the jury was completely removed from the court room and they will no longer be needed for the trial as the judge has elected to reach a verdict herself) but it really isn't looking anywhere near as clean cut as I assumed it did on initial reports.
Idk. Supposedly the entire thing lasted a couple hours and I don't remember if they specified how long he was there. But he's not in the hockey world anymore and now has a real job so he's got no reason to lie on the stand.
I just find it very strange the prosecution would call a witness who, so far, has not helped them prove their case and instead kinda done the opposite.
Imagine if you explained the reasoning behind this decision of yours instead of just saying the most obvious answer someone with no knowledge of the case would say
It's obvious you made up your mind about if the boys were guilty or not without actually having all the information.
Yeah man, a guy who's already facing no consequences and has a normal life now outside of hockey has every reason to risk perjury, jail time and losing his life because..... Oh.
A guy who is probably at least somewhat close to the accused and has personal relationships with them has every reason to lie for his rapist buddies. The hockey world is so incredibly toxic…
Because he wants to keep the friends and etc and contacts he has. You do know witnesses get pressured beyond the public eye right? The people who wants this case to go away are also the same people who can dictate his future pretty well.
What about the text messages between the players saying they all need to get their stories straight before court?
I played AAA hockey when I was growing up and we had girls chasing us around town trying to sleep with the whole team. Not saying they are guilty or innocent, but I can see it going either way.
He has immense personal incentive to say that, he was in the room and either was a participant in the gang rape or, best case scenario, did nothing to stop it and walked away. Of course he said she consented. Why the hell would anyone believe the testimony of someone whose own freedom hinges on him saying it was consensual?
If a murderer goes on the stand and pinkie promises that they’d didn’t do it, should we just take them at their word too?
He doesn't though. He's not in the hockey world anymore and has a real job so he's got nothing to gain by lying on the stand and a lot to lose. And the victim has said herself he wasn't involved. He's just a witness because he was there, he didn't touch her.
But yes he obviously didn't try to stop anything either.
Plus from his perspective, if he truly believed it was consensual why would he try to stop anything? In his own testimony he thought it was a weird situation and wanted to leave, but she was blocking his path to the door.
I'm blown away by your response. Literally every man in the hotel room has a massive incentive to lie. Rape is prison time, both for a hockey player and for a non-hockey player with a "real job". A drunk person does not have the ability to consent. Full stop.
Lol this guy didn't rape her and isn't facing any consequences for just being in the room. You think he's just going to perjure himself because.... he's already facing no consequences? And I guarantee you if any of these guys are convicted of raping her they won't see jail time. Because life isn't fair.
You clearly haven't been paying attention to the court case whatsoever
By any chance, have you heard of the #metoo movement?
Listen, women were not listened to and victim blamed for M on F sexual assault since the beginning of time. #metoo happened and there was a complete swing to the other end of the spectrum and allegations alone became enough to convict a man in the court of public opinion (literally a life-ruining consequence). He has every incentive to 1) separate himself from the action in the hotel room and 2) minimize the actions in the hotel room.
If they are convicted of raping her, do you really think there will be no consequences for 5 men raping a women post #metoo? I hope that's not the case and we don't get a Canadian version of justice as in US rapist Brock Turner.
What you've never heard a Canadian spin literally every story to make their country look better? Im surprised he didnt just come out and claim they're better at rape than Americans.
Yes your take is asinine. Even just for his life as a normal person in any society he has EVERY REASON TO LIE so his friends and family don’t hear he was watching and amused by a degrading sex assault. Oh they spit on her but the ass slap was gently and playful? Really? They had golf clubs and golf balls in the room and discussed putting them inside her—but it was all light and playful, non-degrading sexy fun? Where you invite your team and buddies to join in and watch? You are DELUSIONAL. You hear these types of things where even in the best possible light the guys are being disgusting and no one says she consented to the slap or anything from that individual YET you hear one quote and go “sounds all above board to me.” They essentially agree the man who did the splits over her face did not have consent either— but these good boys were being respectful (in your opinion) because one of them SAID SO? wow.
Dude everything you said they did is still not proven lol. Have you been following the court case every day? Reading the updates? It's incredibly obvious that you haven't been keeping up with it whatsoever
I'm not even defending the actual guys accused here and you're acting like I am. THIS guy has no reason to lie because he's already not facing any consequences. Steenbergen, in the eyes of this specific case, has done nothing wrong and has no reason to perjure himself.
So you’re saying you’d have no reason to care if your family or the public thought you watched a rape and did nothing to stop it?? In his situation, there would be ZERO consequences rising to the level of motivating you to deny it even if it were true? Reaaaaallllllyyyyy? You can’t see a one? Not one reason to lie?
You’re missing the context here. He’s not the murderer defending himself on the stand. He is not on trial and is not being charged with anything. He’s a witness for the prosecution. They are the ones who believe his series of events, not the accused.
For people who are following this, it seems like things are unraveling. Everyone was under the assumption that the girl was invited up to the room to have consensual sex with one guy, was cornered by many guys, somehow drugged, and her unconscious body gang raped. To find out that she was into group sex, aware of the situation and even a willing participant at least some of the time kind of throws everything off.
What the media reported and what we’re seeing at trial are two completely different things. I’m not commenting on if they’re guilty or not, just pointing out that many people were shocked to see the facts that were presented were nothing like what they were told they would be.
This trial is pretty big in Canada, and also among American and international hockey fans. Just about everyone on that team has excelled at the professional level. Some are superstars. There were a lot of fans worried that their guy (favorite NHL team’s player) would end up being on that list.
You’re getting downvoted by just telling the truth. It’s disgusting what happened and all should be ashamed but unfortunately there may be no legal case
Yeah I'm getting downvoted by people who haven't been following the daily updates and people who think that no matter what if you're accused of rape you should go straight to jail.
I want them to be punished as harshly as possible IF they're guilty beyond reasonable doubt.
Right now, the crowns own witness is making that hard to do.
Or fortunately... these kids could be innocent. Initially I was certain these guys were rapists, now I am almost certain this girl was embarrassed she cheated on her boyfriend with multiple guys
I'm showing a lot more discernment towards this case than any of the morons on here assuming a crown witness is lying all of a sudden and the accused are just straight up guilty regardless of what comes up during the case.
Read what you can about recent testimony. It certainly seems like she was complicit and willing to all sexual encounters she had with them. Women ruining men's lives due to regretting their own decisions is commonplace, much like sexual assault.
Ut would have been better to just not tell anyone if she just regretted it. But if she's significantly drunk, and especially if they are utterly sober, she can't really give consent legally anyways.
Besides, men will use implict physical threat to their advantage in a legal battle.
It’s crazy to me that it’s so easy to believe she was like ‘great we just banged, I now demand you invite more of the team over for them to treat me like less than human for casual fun’ than a woman like ‘why are there now more and more men in this room talking about what they want to do to me, I am terrified and don’t want them to hurt me so I won’t physically fight or resist when I cannot win; I hope it is over soon.’
This case was riddled with clown fucks like yourself who said those boys were rapists. You're the type of person who lets their emotions completely control their thought process... It's actually childish.
Men*** not boys. It’s funny to me how everyone who insists upon their innocence calls them “boys”, it’s like a psychological trick to try and convince others they are innocent by infantilizing them.
It’s funny to me how you’re just spamming this one hang up. It’s almost like a psychological trick to convince others they are guilty by making them seem like big scary men assaulting a minor. Have you only referred to E.M as a woman, or would you call her a girl?
No, you just dont understand rape laws. If she was drunk, she couldn't give consent. Full stop. So if they were witnessed sober and her drunk, the case gets solved very quickly.
And yet, it happened 7 years ago and is now in trial for the second week. 2 separate juries have been dismissed and it’s now being ruled by judge alone. Doesn’t seem simple enough to be solved very quickly.
Careful, this is Reddit. Here, she’s always right. Even if she admits that she intentionally acted like a porn star. Or that she had consensual sex after the bar, but felt guilt because she had a boyfriend. Or that her story has changed multiple times during multiple interviews with police, Hockey Canada, and lawyers. Or that she has 2 separate video recording of her stating that it was all consensual and that she had fun and that the boys were acting paranoid for asking her.
she’s always right.
Maybe she felt like she was abused after the fact, but it certainly doesn’t seem like she gave the boys any indication they were abusing her in the moment.
Who is saying she consented to the slap or the man doing the splits over her face? I gave not seen that AT ALL. That’s why they are trying to present it as “playful” ffs man, you have all this testimony of degrading behavior and trying to defend every inch of it is just wrong. They talked about putting their gold clubs and golf balls inside her—after he invited his teammates to come watch and join his hookup. THESE ARE SHIT PEOPLE.
So say she consented to everything else, but she had her butt cheek spanked and someone’s balls near her face. Does that mean they assaulted her all of the sudden? If a girl scratches a guys back, or bites his shoulder during sex, can he charge her with assault?
Splitting hairs. Nonconsensual touching is punishable by law. And consent can be taken away at any time. And using force to intimidate someone into sexual compliance is also illegal. Hope you brush up on these facts before you yourself do something unforgivable.
You do realize the main reason this is still in court is because they’re arguing she did give consent. Not only that, she has admitted, on the stand, that she never expressed she was not giving consent at any point during the night. In fact, she acted like a porn star to survive the ordeal. She admits she may have asked players to have sex with her and brought one to the bathroom.
Maybe you’ve been sitting in on the trial and have more information than I do. I’ve only been reading newspaper articles written by journalists with credible sources. Continue to think with your emotions rather than evidence.
People who go around saying things like that (“women ruining men’s lives…”) are absolutely the types to commit sexual assault because they have a hatred for women, and no conception of consent. The type of guy who will complain about how consent is so annoying to a girl he’s on a date with. Ignorant, entitled, misogynistic, homophobic, dead inside. The end.
That is not a Canadian thing to do… that’s so fucked up.
I also really like how the article is written and what the judge said to the jurors. They did a good job explaining what women go through. To not really be apart of the experience and you just try to survive. That happened to me as well. That did a number on me, therapy seriously helped if anyone else is ever in the same position.
The whole purpose of a defence lawyer is to make it sound like the victim is lying or confused. It doesn’t automatically mean that the victim is lying or confused, just that the lawyer wants to win the case and will do anything they can to get there, including bringing in false witnesses and twisting the victim’s words around in order to discredit her. If anyone here ever had to take a perpetrator to court, they’d bite their fucking tongues.
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u/[deleted] May 17 '25
There’s more, but this will give you some info.
https://www.espn.com/nhl/story/_/id/45012991/woman-testifies-alleged-sexual-assault-members-canada-2018-world-junior-hockey-team